<鲸鱼的声音座头鲸在唱>

鲸鱼。海洋中的顶级掠食者，一种巨大的海洋动物，世界上最神秘和壮观的动物之一。

<淡出音乐>

鲸的种类很多:逆戟鲸、白鲸、独角鲸、座头鲸、抹香鲸……分散在世界广阔的海洋中……

他们有不同的语言、部落、狩猎技术……不同的文化、行为和喂养仪式——有些比其他更难以记录。

有人告诉我，在鲸鱼生物学家中有这样一句老话，“总有一天，我们会知道关于鲸鱼的一切，除了抹香鲸幼崽是怎样吃奶的。”

我今天的嘉宾，布莱恩·斯科利，目睹了这一幕:一只幼抹香鲸正在哺乳，他捕捉到了他认为是第一个一帧一帧地记录这个过程的图像。

我是Pakinam Amer，您正在收听的是科学美国人播客《科学谈话》。新利18luck体育

< >音乐了

国家地理探险家、杰出的鲸鱼摄影师布莱恩·斯科利(Brian Skerry)告诉我，除了是他新纪录片系列和新书的主要独家新闻外，哺乳小牛是母亲和孩子之间非常温柔和私密的时刻。

鲸鱼相信他能靠近并拍摄它，因为他屏住呼吸，因为他在没有氧气的情况下潜水。

我们中的许多人会付出什么来接近鲸鱼，对吧?看到了其他人不可能看到的东西

欢迎来到布莱恩的生活。

但是，尽管与抹香鲸的那一刻令人敬畏，但这并不是布莱恩在为迪士尼+拍摄四集纪录片《鲸鱼的秘密》的艰苦三年之旅中捕捉到的唯一不同寻常的事情

布莱恩的电影胶片包括许多珍宝……从见证挪威北极地区的一个葬礼队伍，一个虎鲸家庭抬着一只死去的小牛哀悼，到被邀请与另一只鲸鱼分享一顿黄貂鱼。

用他自己的话来说……

之前还没有完全完成的部分

今天，在2021年地球日，我们将讨论他在水上和水下的壮观冒险，以捕捉一些漫步在地球上的最古老生物的生命。

该系列在22个地点拍摄，追踪不同的鲸鱼群……

在阿根廷巴塔哥尼亚，一只强壮的豆荚在巨浪中捕食海狮……

一个在挪威北极圈上空200英里的吊舱，另一个在福克兰群岛……

在加拿大北部坎宁安温暖的海洋里，一个豆荚在春天变成了一个巨大的鲸鱼托儿所，还有更多。

<漂亮>

持续时间0:49秒:“真正的白鲸只有一条……像幽灵一样。同样神秘的是……白鲸微笑，用面部表情表达情感。它们拥有海洋中最大的词汇量之一，甚至可能给自己起名字>

文化是布莱恩·斯科利说他的新系列和新书聚焦的关键词，也是真正将它们与其他鲸鱼电影或书籍区别开来的地方。

长期以来，自然历史电影制作和摄影，包括我自己几十年来的工作，都是从某种临床的立场或观点来处理这些野生动物的故事。我们观察这些动物，观察它们的行为，这本身就很迷人。在很多情况下，这就是故事的结尾。

但当我创作《鲸鱼的秘密》时，我是带着观察多种鲸鱼的愿望去做的。经过十年的研究，我确定了文化这个概念，因为在鲸鱼生物学领域发表的很多最新最伟大的科学研究都在谈论这个，这个想法，这个事实的概念，在基因相同的物种中，比如人类，鲸鱼的行为是不同的。

所以你可能有一群生活在新西兰的虎鲸和一群生活在阿根廷巴塔哥尼亚的虎鲸，它们都是同一个物种，你知道，它们本质上是一样的。但他们的做法有所不同。例如，它们偏爱国际美食，新西兰的虎鲸喜欢吃黄貂鱼，巴塔哥尼亚的虎鲸喜欢吃(象)海豹，它们已经想出了捕食策略，去吃它们喜欢的民族食物。他们是世界上唯一这样做的人。

不仅如此，他们还教他们的后代，他们的孩子，因为没有更好的类比，如何做这些事情。所以他们在传递他们的后代和下一代需要知道的生存技能，但他们也在传递他们祖先的传统，对他们来说很重要的东西，他们的文化。

你知道，和我一起工作的一位科学家已经成为了我的好朋友。在整个项目中，Shane Gero博士，他在过去的15年里一直在多米尼加和东加勒比研究抹香鲸，他这样描述不同之处:他说，行为是我们所做的。文化是我们做事的方式

巴基纳姆:布莱恩告诉我，鲸鱼家族有不同的方言。他们住在飞地里，他把那里比作20世纪初的纽约社区。

例如，抹香鲸不会与其他基因相同的鲸鱼混在一起，如果它们说不同的方言。

当抹香鲸互相打招呼时，它们会停下来说“嗨”。“他们真的是。比如，嗨，我来自多米尼加，其他鲸鱼可能会回答，我来自海地。然后他们走自己的路。

《鲸鱼的秘密》的故事是，如果我们通过文化的镜头来看待海洋，这些动物在许多方面做着许多反映人类文化的事情，它们有个性和情感。他们分享悲伤，分享快乐，他们有歌唱比赛，他们玩游戏。你知道，我认为这有点改变了游戏规则，它不再是临床的。我们不是从一万两千英尺的高度看，你知道，有点像科学家在实验室里看。我们将直接进入动物的世界，我们将看到这些动物是多么复杂和复杂，以及它们在海洋中的社会

< >采访

< PAKINAM:<年代trong>你从上到下见识过这个世界。你知道，从我在你的系列中看到的，你在这些令人惊叹的、宏伟的风景中生活和呼吸。但首先，作为一个完全不潜水的人，让我问一个问题，你工作的环境有多恶劣或危险?>

无论何时我们进入海洋，我们都必须认识到这对人类来说是一个陌生的环境，你知道，我们是陆地生物。如果没有自给自足的水肺设备和呼吸器，我们真的无法在那里生存很长时间。但是，话虽如此，我不会说它过于敌对，我不认为我们在下水的那一刻有什么必要害怕的。这是一个陌生的环境。我们本身并不是水生生物。但是在水中潜水时，《鲸鱼的秘密》的大部分工作，几乎所有的工作都是用自由潜水完成的，就是屏气潜水。所以我们实际上没有使用水肺或换气器或类似的东西，我们只是屏住呼吸游下去，试图接近这些动物，如果它们允许我们进入它们的世界，这并不是特别危险的。你必须受过训练，有资格，而且在海洋中还算舒服。但除此之外，没有来自动物的真正威胁

鲸鱼摄影有多有挑战性?我是说，有些潜水你是怎么准备的?你游到那里什么都看不到的可能性有多大?>

你知道，你在和科学家交谈，你在计算一年中的什么时候你可能会看到这些动物。能见度是什么样的?你觉得我们能接近吗?那里有船吗?我们可以租一艘船吗?所以你知道，试图缩小失败的可能性，因为鲸鱼摄影这样的东西总是很高的。在我的书《鲸鱼的秘密》中，我写到了维恩图。如果我们要画一个维恩图，上面有所有这些重叠的圆圈，所有的东西都必须与鲸鱼摄影对齐，你最终会在中间这个非常小的圆圈，你有成功的机会，因为，你知道，你去一个地方，假设我们去新西兰，发现逆戟鲸在吃黄貂鱼。嗯，虎鲸并不总是在那里，它们在整个国家，北部，南岛。我们的基地在北岛。 And what if the orca is out there, and then we need a boat to get out? Well, the weather has to be good, it can't be very windy, and there can't be any ocean storms. And then if the Orca is there, and there's no storms, and it's not too windy, you can get out. But then if you jump in the water and the visibility underwater is poor, you're not going to be able to get those pictures, you know, unlike a terrestrial photographer, I can't use 1000-millimeter lens underwater, a 600-millimeter lens, we have to get within a few meters of our subject to get good pictures. And then the sun has to be out because I can't light a whale underwater, they're too big. So to have color and detail, it's very helpful for the sun to be out. Then the animal has to let you close, if they don't want you near them, they'll just swim the other direction. And then if you get close, and the water is clear, and the sun is out, and all those things are happening, they have to be doing something interesting, they either have to be with another whale or they're exhibiting behavior that is culture. So you know it, there's a lot that you can try to control. But at the end of the day, you're really, you know, at the mercy of all of these variables that you cannot control. So, it's a very ambitious project to say that we're going to do, you know, five species of whales worldwide from the equator to the poles. And we're going to produce a story about culture that's never really been done before. But we were very blessed along the way. We got very lucky. And not only did we get all the things we had on our shot list, but we got these amazing moments that we couldn't have ever scripted>

布莱恩，你不是海洋科学家或生物学家，但你探索海洋的时间和许多科学家一样长。在这个系列中，我们是否看到了超越我们已经从科学和研究中了解到的关于鲸鱼的新见解，或者这只是我们所听到的关于您在整个系列中一直关注的五种鲸鱼的事情的记录?<年代trong>>

两者都有一点。你知道，当我在考虑这个项目时，我所做的是，最终写一个提案是在研究人员的工作基础上建立鲸鱼的秘密。它必须根植于科学之中。虽然在这个神秘的，你知道的，兔子洞里可能会很有趣，只是想想这些动物有多奇妙，他们是外星人之类的，但这不是我们想做的。这必须是基础科学，必须是真实的。我们没有必要在此基础上进行推断。话虽如此，我经常描述我的工作是我空降到研究人员的生活中，这些男人和女人把他们的整个生命，他们的事业，都奉献给了出去，试图揭示这些奥秘。他们揭开了神秘的层层面纱，像谢恩这样的人，或者我的一个朋友，南·豪瑟博士，他在库克群岛研究座头鲸，或者英格丽德·维瑟，在新西兰研究虎鲸。你知道，这些人日复一日地，和这些动物一起工作，他们逐渐了解它们，他们了解它们的行为，它们的性格，它们的家庭。所以我所做的就是空降一个月或其他时间段，我试着给他们的故事提供视觉背景。 You know, the reality, unfortunately, is that not many people read the scientific papers that they publish. So they might be publishing things that maybe I'm reading about whale culture, but most folks wouldn't know that. So I'm trying to bring my skills from more than 40 years of exploring the ocean and making pictures 23 years with National Geographic and bringing together teams of people that can really amplify these messages. Now, in the course of that work, we are trying to have a set of shortlist, you know, a shortlist that we know we want to try to get this: we want to get a picture of babysitting with sperm whales and Dominica, or we want to get orcas in New Zealand catching stingrays. But then other things happen that we couldn't predict. So in Domenico with the sperm whales, I had a very relaxed and trusting new mom, allow me into her world she was down about maybe 15 or 20 meters, nursing her calf, and I was able to hold my breath and swim down. And she very trustingly allowed me close and I was able to get what we believe are the first images of a sperm whale calf nursing. So that night I showed Dr. Gero, Shane Gero, and he said, this is magnificent, Brian, you know, he alerted all of his colleagues. And he said, You know, there's an old saying in the whale biology world that “someday we'll know everything there is to know about whales, except how a sperm whale calf nurses.” They couldn't figure out what that big lower jaw was [and] how they could possibly do it. And now we have this frame by frame analysis. But this is from a documentary standpoint. It's such a tender moment with this mom and baby. So you know, we know that they did this, but we've never seen it in, nor with the orcas in New Zealand. You know, I had this female adult Orca that not only caught a stingray and swam towards me, but then she dropped it as if offering me food. And then I go down to the bottom and I kneel next to this dead stingray and she comes back. And she's, you know, positions her body directly in front of me with the ray in between us. And she's looking at me and looking at the ray as if to say, ‘Well come on, Brian, you're going to eat that I'm giving you this, right.’ And when I don't eat it, then she gently picks it up and moves on. So again, we know that they eat stingrays. But to be able to have that kind of moment to see an orca in the Norwegian Arctic, a family of Orca with the mother carrying its dead calf in this sort of funeral procession of mourning ceremony was heartbreaking. Again, we know about this stuff, but to be able to capture it on film and to you know, weave it into the narrative of a story about these sentient creatures that have culture. I think that's that's the part that maybe hasn't quite been ever done before>

<漂亮>

您正在收听的是科学美国人播客《科学谈话》。新利18luck体育

接下来是布莱恩深入鲸鱼世界的收获。

当所有的拍摄完成后，总共有179兆兆字节的镜头。一吨的材料。

这花了三年时间。但几乎让人感觉布莱恩·斯科利(Brian Skerry)在过去的四十年里都在为这个系列做准备。

住在缅因州约克的布莱恩告诉我，他从15岁左右开始就一直在潜水，在深海里观察海洋和海洋里的动物。

他在罗德岛的一艘租船上工作了大约10年，没有报酬。

没有报酬?你是怎么活下来的?>

我也做其他工作。你知道，我是说，我来自一个纺织厂小镇，一个工人阶级小镇。我没有钱做这些事。所以我唯一能去潜水的办法就是坐我负担不起的船。所以我免费工作。冬天的时候我会躺在洞下的雪地上，拿着研磨机打磨洞，在洞上涂漆，夏天的时候我会在船上工作，带人们潜水，我自己也可以去潜水，拍照。所以当我做其他工作时，你知道，我在工厂工作过，我做过销售，我在便利店工作过，我做过很多不同的工作来支持我的摄影，直到我只能做摄影。但是，是的，成为一名全职专业摄影师是一段漫长的进化之路

在接下来的部分中，我们将讨论他多年来为鲸鱼和其他海洋生物拍摄的独特照片，但也会讨论大局——也许是最大的问题:保护、污染、环境，以及海洋生物如何为人类的生活方式和选择付出巨大代价。

我们谈论的是一个现在充满塑料的海洋世界，以及一些海底遗址是如何成为过去的阴影。

<漂亮>

迪士尼+与《科学美国人》分享了该系列中一新利18luck体育个相当令人心碎的片段，显示一条鲸鱼失去了一部分下巴，一只乌龟被困在废墟中，拖着一个塑料洗衣篮。

国家地理的潜水员陪同布莱恩和摄制组进行了干预，将海龟从死亡陷阱中解救了出来。

这是我剪掉的第三个了。如果你说你看到过同样的情况，我的意思是我们花了很多时间在水上，但这实在是太多了

并不是所有的海洋动物都这么幸运。

布莱恩告诉我，他在拍摄过程中看到了很多这样的场景，他也不避讳在剧中加入这些场景。

所有生活在陆地上的人类……我们从陆地中心的角度来看待我们的土地，或者我们的世界，我们是陆地生物，所以我们认为一切都是关于土地的，但如果你从太空看地球，如果我们看到这些来自卫星或NASA或其他地方的照片，你知道，很明显我们生活在这个美丽的蓝色宝石上，漂浮在黑暗的太空中。但同样显而易见的是，我们生活在一个海洋世界，地球表面72%是海洋。但也许更重要的是，98%的生物圈，地球上98%的生命可以存在的地方是海洋，是水。所以作为人类，探索这个多水的星球、了解它、保护它是我们的最大利益所在。人类的每一次呼吸都来自海洋，它是最大的碳汇。在地球上，它吸收碳，并把我们呼吸的50%以上的氧气还给我们。然而，我们已经向大气中排放了如此多的碳，以至于海洋中的化学成分正在发生变化，它已经变得像海绵一样饱和，并正在变成酸;这是海洋酸化，腐蚀了海洋中的许多东西。你知道，在二战后的60年里，我们捕捞了海洋中90%的大鱼，金枪鱼，长嘴鱼，鲨鱼。我们每年在地球上杀死超过1亿只鲨鱼，我们不可能从任何生态系统中去除1亿只顶级掠食者，还指望它没事。 We've lost half the world's coral reefs, more than 50% of the world's coral reefs have gone in the last few decades. And every single year, we dump 18 billion pounds of plastic into the ocean. So I think the message here is that we live in an ocean world. And that, you know, we see now the damage that we are causing on a daily basis. When I started diving in the late 1970s and 1980s, I never saw plastic in the ocean. I never saw these problems today. Almost every single dive that I make anywhere in the world, I see these problems. I go back to places that I visited a decade ago and they are a shadow of what they used to be [...] in Sri Lanka, we went to try to film sperm whales and we were successful. This is a place where they know about blue whales. But although they know that sperm whales are there, they haven't been studied for a very long time, we went to a part of the country where there was really no infrastructure. So we had to hire fishing boats. And we would go out every day long distances and search for the whales and we would find them. But inevitably, on many of those days, we would also find sea turtles up on the surface, just wrapped in plastic. They were completely entangled in polypropylene and plastic fishing nets and fishing lines. … I actually have photos of one that was so wrapped in plastic and it was dragging a laundry basket a big orange plastic basket that was probably on a fishing boat, they maybe put rope in in line or so forth. But you know, we were able to cut those turtles out of those entanglements and set them free and they seemed healthy enough and strong, so they're probably fine. But as I left Sri Lanka, after three weeks of being there, I couldn't help but think about all the ones that we're not seeing. You know, if that happens so frequently while we were there, it must be happening all the time. And it's not just Sri Lanka, it's everywhere. Everywhere I go in the world. I've been on some of the most remote beaches in the South Pacific places that took me, you know, five days by boat from Fiji to get to uninhabited islands and I walked down what should have been white sandy beaches and I was up to my calves in plastic trash, you know, the whole way. So these are important problems and even though Secrets of the Whales is more of a celebration of these animals, you know, I think it's important to focus on some of these problems as well, to tell a more complete story >

< PAKINAM:你看过多少伤害已经造成过去三、四年自从你开始跳水,就像你指出的那样,这是一个非常不同的世界,你曾经看到早在80年代,所以你觉得人们一直听你的故事和保护别人的故事展示了地球连接,我们几乎破坏它…你认为人们更加具有智慧以任何方式或意识到现在吗?或者你是否有过这样的时刻，你觉得这样的请求被置若罔闻?

我确实觉得今天有更多的人意识到并关心这些事情。2007年，我为《国家地理》杂志做了一篇封面报道，关于全球渔业危机，过度捕捞的问题，商业，工业化，过度捕捞，海洋中90%的大鱼被捕捞。我花了两年的时间环游世界，拍摄这些主题，这些问题。我真的变得很沮丧。我的身体变得沮丧，无论我走到哪里，坏消息都太多了。然后我们决定我们需要一个解决方案的故事，同样的问题，所以我去了很多次，我去了新西兰，因为新西兰在保护他们的专属经济区，他们的沿海和开放海洋生态系统方面非常进步。我遇到了一位古代科学家，他可以说是海洋保护区之父，他叫比尔·巴坛博士。一天晚上，晚饭后，我坐在他在新西兰的小木屋里，你知道，我告诉他我对我所看到的一切感到多么糟糕。他说，你知道，布莱恩，我相信如果我们把理智的人聚集在世界上任何一个房间里，我们向他们展示事实，告诉他们海洋对他们的生活有多重要，大多数科学家会说，我们需要保护世界上30%或40%的海洋。然而今天，在2007年，我们只有1%。 He said, I think most people will say, Well, my goodness, you know, let's do it. What's the problem? Why aren't we doing it? Our children need food to eat and air to breathe and clean water and commerce and all these things the ocean brings us. But he said, the problem is, most people don't know it. So that gave me hope. And you know, in the 14 years since that story was published, I guess in 2007, I feel that we have made traction. You know, today where maybe at five or six or even 7% of the oceans are protected in some fashion, not all marine reserves, but in some fashion. So there have been countries that have recognized the need to do this. But, you know, we're still a long way from 30 or 40%. I think that window of opportunity is closing, you know, the planet is dying a death from 1000 cuts that are largely because of us. And although I remain cautiously optimistic, I do think that our timetable is shrinking, and that we have to get on this. So there's still forces out there and elements who don't want to believe in these things who don't want to accept anthropogenic climate change, or all these other ills that we are causing. So it's not going to be easy, but the basic answer to your question is yes, we have definitely made progress in the last decade or more. And I think we're still making that incremental progress. The question is, how quickly will that change come>

布莱恩·斯科利报道。他的电视剧《鲸鱼的秘密》由西格妮·韦弗精彩解说，詹姆斯·卡梅隆执行制片，今天在迪士尼+首播

这就是科学讲座，我是主持人Pakinam Amer。谢谢大家的聆听。

< >音乐了